One on One: Neil McCarthy

Part 2 of 3: Rhythm City Soapie Review:

The first thing you notice when you meet Neil McCarthy is that he makes a better leading man than a scribe, let alone a headwriter.  You kind of picture him as Billy Flynn in a Chicago, but I am not sure if his dance moves could out -do the ones Richard Gere gave us in the movie.  The man has a presence that commands respect and has a certain calm about him that can defuse Debra Patta’s wrath.  So there in his modest office, my interview begun, in the hope that by the time it is over, I would leave his office baptized and converted to become religious fan of RC.

PHATHU MAKWARELA (PM): Neil, you seem to be doing very well here at RC.

NEIL McCarthy (NM): well, Thank you.

PM: How are you?

NM: Great, we are feeling a little bit better about the show. We have been through a rough couple of months, but it now seems like we are coming out of the other side in terms of stories.

PM: Do you think your show was snubbed at the SAFTAS? (I just had to ask this one, couldn’t resist)

NM: I do not know, you know awards. I have been in this industry long enough not to be concerned about them.  When they come your way, they do and when they don’t, they don’t.

PM: Come on Neil; don’t tell me they do not matter because we both know they do?

NM: I am serious. I am happy when I get them, it’s great but you can’t always worry when you don’t get them. It is an opinion of a little thermometer of the moment.

PM: How difficult was it to start RC? (He started with the show)

NM: It was a wonderful gift to start a show from the start; I did it with Isidingo years back. When I did Isidingo I was much younger and after two years I got tired when I realized that running a soap is not as fun as building one, so I moved on. This time I’m much older and have obligations, so I stuck around. Running a soap is a very hard business, you churn out six scripts a week. You do not even have time to stop.  I prefer starting a show than working on one.

PM: Neil, you’re at the helm of E-TV flagship program, what is bigger than that?

NM: (he laughs), that is part of my problem. It is great, it is a wonderful opportunity, and it is an exciting rollercoaster. It is great to do drama, I love it and I enjoy it. I love telling stories and engaging with characters and finding out what makes a great story.

PM: What makes a great story for Rhythm City?

NM: I think a good story must have a good heart and calls for great emotions from a viewer. A good story must be firmly in place, which sounds simple but is not. With all the experience and support, I have from a very experienced team; we still get it wrong sometimes. Two months down the line, we can look at a story and say, this story has lost its emotion.  You must always ask yourself when developing a story; in what way is it engaging emotionally with a viewer and the character? (I guess Phathu has also learned something new here)

PM: Neil, what I find with the show is that most of your storylines do not come from characters. I feel that you create a melo-dramatic plot-driven storylines and then pigeonhole a characters to carry the stories. As you know in soaps, character drives the story not plot.

NM: Look you know, (he takes a deep pause), my fundamental philosophy in doing drama is that stories need to be real. They do need to relate to real world of our audience.  The feedback we get from our audience is that they do perceive our stories as a reflection of the real world. More than they would perceive Isidingo or  Generations. However, I do feel that we embark on a journey, like Lucille, Miles and David triangle – having created that pregnancy.  You then have to play it out, and it felt like a great story then, but actually the further down we got into the story, we realized that it’s hard to tell these kinds of stories. I mean the pregnancy has to be nine months at least, it ended up being longer and how many times can you go down that alley again and again? And you know, maybe you can point fingers and say this story has pushed this series into a melo-dramatic arena than would have even been ideal, and yes it probably has. That is not going to be the future of Rhythm City and it does not represent the stylistic view of the show. We as the story team are very conscious that we must tell more real stories, we want to pull the show into real stories based on characters than plots

PM: What is the future of Rhythm of City?

NM: (Laughs), well you know the future is years and years down the line. We are doing stories that will reflect the world of our viewers. There are dramas and challenges, trials and tribulations. We are working on a story like, housing scam, it’s got all the political connections. It’s… (Sorry people, I had to remove this, as I do not want to give the story away…). It is going to be a very exciting story that our viewers will relate to. We are continuously looking for these stories that can really engage with our viewers and try make the most of the characters we have set up.

PM: Does the channel pressure you to do stories that will give good ARS?

NM: Sure, it is all about the ARS.

PM: Have you ever sacrificed your belief in drama and did a story because you knew it would bring good ARS and that is what E-TV wants?

NM: (he takes a long pause, to think I guess or remember the last thing E-TV bosses told him) you know, I can’t say that the channel has been prescriptive in terms of stories. They have never said we need these stories to drive ARS, they have been very good and understand the experience in our team.  But they have told us that what we care about is ARS, we want to get as many viewers into that time slot as we can. And we want to hold them in the channel for longer, they do have input in stories but they haven’t interfered much. (I so wish I were him)

PM: But when the stories fail, the bucket stops with you?

NM: Yeah, ultimately yes!

PM: So it means you were very happy when Greg ruined Isidingo for the better part of the past two years. People  tuned to Rhythm City. (I hope to never meet Greg, he might punch me)

NM: Yes, I suppose. I would not point fingers but yes, Isidingo did fall of the porch. But Isidingo is not pursuing the same audience as us, we only have two percent of white people watching us.  But to some degree, there is a segment of the audience that we are competing for.

PM: You started Isidingo, what comes to your mind now when you see it now? Are you happy with it?

NM: You know I am still proud of it; it is a great show, a great brand.  I think the greatest contribution I have ever made to TV was creating Cherel and the Matabane family. Those were guys that I sat behind the laptop and dreamt up, I am very proud of it. The people that work on that show are my colleagues, I know them very well and they are professional. We sit around and share ideas; it is not like we are enemies.

PM: Do you want to turn Rhythm city is a reputable brand like Isidingo?

NM: Rhythm City is a different beast and it is on a different channel, but I can only be true to my values in storytelling.  I can only tell the stories I relate to and do them as well as I can. Which is what I was trying to do in Isidingo, I had never worked on a soap before Isidingo.

PM: What do you say to critics of the show, there has been stories that make one wonder what the motivation behind it was. The Dephoka suicide for an example. Why did you feel the need to stretch that girl’s suicide over two episodes?  Why did we have to see her die for two episodes non-stop, when you could have killed her in one episode?

NM: No, the whole point of the story was to drag the audience to come back the next day. When you get those golden moments in a story, when you know that you have built it slowly to this huge climax and you have done it to detail, you want to extend that climax as much as possible. I am looking at a scene now, and you will be back moaning to me in six months time. The climax deals with Lucille’s baby and it extends over four episodes!  (Then he cracks up, prepare yourself guys)

PM: But that is milking a story?

NM: You have to think of the ARS.

PM: So you do admit that the stories are AR driven?

NM: Of course you have to think about the ARS,  TV is about ARS. It’s about getting as many people watching your show as you can.

PM: At all cost?

NM: At all cost is debatable. If one had overdone the story, viewers will have tuned off. And there have been times were we have pissed off our viewers. Do you know that the Diphuka story was good for us, it gave us great ARS and I am proud of that moment?

PM: Let’s talk about David Genaro as a character, haven’t you stretched him too far as a character?

NM: We might have, we might be about to, (me thinks something big is coming because his response was followed by a mischievous laugh, the one that says I know something you don’t)

PM: What are you going to do with him in two years time, for him not to become redundant?

NM: You will have to stay engaged; I tell you ,we have plans. We are not unaware of the problems. But I think we have enough material to keep him interesting for years to come.

PM: I battle to find the human emotion in David; to me he is either paranoid or psychotic. I do not see him as whole character who is motivated to do what he does.  What drives him; he kills people for no apparent reason. I think you’re about to make the same mistake Isidingo did, taking Barker to the extreme and viewers lost interest in the character, a character cannot just be a villain with no substance. Neil, you kill characters every four months. (At this point, I felt he was getting pissed off , but he kept his cool)

NM: Hei, we have stopped on that killing of characters, (a deep sigh). Look, I don’t know, you know, the audience research does not support what you say. All the research shows that he is the most popular character on our show. Nobody criticized the character, but some people did say he should be punished; he must pay for his crimes. They love him and enjoy watching him. We did not get anything similar to your kind of analysis. He is a great character and we will keep him going for as long as possible.  I will check in with you to see if or when we have stretched him too far. (This was followed by a laugh, still not sure if he was tired of my questions or getting irritated with them)

PM: What do you say to people who are critics of the show;   Isidingo is more like the Mail and Guardian, whereas Rhythm City is more like Sunday world.

NM: I don’t agree with you, it’s certainly not the way we view it. I think to some degree we suffer from a Backstage hangover and also from the image that E-TV has as a channel. That It is the home of superficial sensational stuff, soft porn and wrestling.  But e-tv has proved that they are serious with their soaps. But people are entitled to their views and if those are their views, who am I to say they are wrong. I do think there is some kind of prejudice against e-tv as a channel and the show. I will challenge people with those views, are you really watching the show for what it’s worth or coming with pre-conceived ideas of what E-TV offers? We do not go into the show trying to make the tabloid sensation that Sunday world does.  We do not always get it right, we make mistakes, sure, but we do not have an exploitative mindset behind the stories we tell.

PM: What do you still want to write? I had to ask a light question before he threw me out of his office.)

NM: Movies, I still want to write a movie that gets made, a good movie that goes to the cinema.

PM: And when are you going back to acting, you can write yourself in RC?

NM: (Finally, he lightens up and gives a genuine laugh) not in this show, occasionally I think I will write myself in. Like I did in Isidingo, I was an interior designer for two weeks, but I think I will create a little role for myself, but not yet.

PM: It’s been great meeting you.

NM: It has been great meeting you, thank for you for the challenging questions.

PM: Come on Neil, I was nice.

He laughs and leads me out of his office.

My thoughts on Neil:

To say I was impressed with Neil is an understatement, I was blown away. Being in his presence humbles you as a writer and you learn to appreciate that there are storytellers out there who are bigger than you are, who can influence and change the way society views itself.  Those who write for soapies will tell you that it is a tiring job.  You lose passion and dedication to do the job halfway through and just do it bcoz it is a job.

With Neil, I found myself in the presence of a man consumed by passion and dedication for what he does; he loves writing and being part of Rhythm city. There is also an element of respect around him and his work, he respects the platform that he has been give and doesn’t take it for granted or with arrogance.  Producing more than two hundred episodes a year takes a lot out of a man, but he seems to do it with grace and humility that you seldom see in TV writers these days. I think his fire comes from his background in TV, as Percy said – this man is a legend. I felt like going home, dusting my CV and sending it him with a big headline, I WANT YOU TO BE MY BOSS.

As much as I was blown away by him and dedication to his work, I was not yet persuaded to become a fan of RC. There was only one person left before I can decide what I think of RC as a whole,  Roliwe Nikiwe, the show’s creator and creative director. My interview with Roliwe Nikiwe will drop on Friday and he turned out to be most funniest man I have ever met.

By Phathu Makwarela ©